However the idea of establishing Gods kingdom on earth is not a new one. As history shows though its not an idea that usually works out particulalry well. The crusades that spanned from 1095-1291 were lead by christians from europe in an attempt to reclaim the Holy Lands from muslim rule. Religon was the driving force behind hundreds of thousands of deaths over that time. The first five crusades had the offical blessing of the church, the sixth crusade that sailed in 1228, did not.
In Nazi germany, while many Pastors sought to help the Jewish people, POWs, others did not. Corrie TenBoom in her book "the Hiding place" tells of an occasion when she was asked to hide a Jewish Mother and her baby. Corrie talks about how she had no contacts and went to a Pastor for assisitance. The Pastor expressed alarm and outrage at the idea.
In the Rwandan genocide, some of the priests sort to protect Tsutsi's from the Hutu lead massacre. Other priests sided with the Hutu militia. Ordinary men like Paul Rusesabagina, a man who worked in a hotel, put his life and the loves of his fmaily at risk, to save over 1000 Tsusi and hutu refugees by giving them shelter in his hotel.
Ordinary christians can change the world, we dont have to be in positions of power in order to make a difference. However it involves living radically. Over the next few blog posts, I am going to cover more on this subject. Untill then.....
Labels: Corrie Ten Boom, Hutu's, Paul Rusesabagina, Rwanda, the Crusades, The Hiding Place, Tutsi's
Mel tells about how he prayed so many times to God to not be gay, under went aversion therapy which delivered electric hocks at times of high arrousal, under went exorcisms generally the whole kit and cabudle. It got me thinking, being delivered from being gay is not nearly as simple as the fundies would have me believe. And it makes me wonder if someone can so desperately desire to be straight and prays and asks God to deliver them, hmmm well some deep thoughts
Labels: Mel White, Phillip Yancey
As for the gay debate. We get so caught up in reminding gays that they are siners and beyond redemption, that we forget they are people who are also loved by God and whom He sent his son to die for.
Labels: Gay, heterosexual, marriage, matrimony
Suicide doesn't come by cowardice, but by desperation. It takes a lot of strength to overcome the instinct to stay alive.The suicide debate is always interesting. There are those that see suicide as an incredibly cowardly thing to do, and there are those who see people as having committed suicde as being brave. I repeated the above quote because I think it bears mention. Suicide isnt brave or cowardly its something that comes at the end of a really long and desperate struggle. It comes because the person can no longer see a way out of the cesspool that is their life. They mistakenly believe that if they are gone from life that can only make life a better place for everyone else.
Suicide is not a decision that a person arrives at easily or even readily, as the aove quote says a persons will to live is very strong and the choice to die usually comes after a very long struggle and the belief that things will never get better and despair that they cant stand living the rest of their life in this state.....Suicide is not driven by bravery or cowardice, but a desire to hopefully put an end to the indescribable anguish a person suffers
If you are suicidal.
I can understand that all encompassing, clods and cesspool. Can understand what its like to feel that there is no way out, and that things will never get better....... If you can hang in their a few monutes longer, the clod doesnt last forever, but when you are stuck in the middle of it, there seems like no escape.
Find someone you can talk to, if you have no one to talk to, you are welcome to drop me an email. I dont propose to be able to fix any of your problems, but have been round the bush enough times to know the value of a non judgemental listening ear
Labels: Suicide
1. Exclusivism. Cults teach that only they have the truth and the correct path to salvation. Leaving the cult is equated with leaving God, and members really believe that leaving the cult means they can never be saved. How many times did I hear that idea propagated. V telling me that CIC was the only church apart from perhaps Destiny Church that had sufficent enough annointing for me to get truly free. PM from the pulpit propagating the idea that most other churches in New Zealand were full of dead wood.
2. Fear, guilt and intimidation. Leadership is feared, and disagreeing with the leadership (or even just questioning it) is akin to disagreeing with God. The mini sermons each week on giving. I remeber one day BM getting up and going on about the widows mite and how it was such a sacrifice for the widows of the church to be giving, and how dare we do any less than them. Absolutley bugged the crap out of me like there were no other groups in the church that struggled to make their tithe but still did.
3. The third aspect is totalitarian control over the lifestyle and time of its members – this totalitarian control is necessary for the leaders to indoctrinate the followers in everything they do, and is also an attempt to separate them from anything not associated with the cult. I am not sure about this one. I know that I was supposed to have unquestioning obdience to people like J and C, however I wonder if it was never pushed to much with me maybe they sensed if they pushed it to much I'd end up telling them to stuff off. . Who was it, V, or someone who said about not giving S all the information at once.....Kind of creepy
4. The fourth aspect common to most cults is a charismatic, self-appointed leader with complete authority - Cult members are taught not to question the teachings, practices, or ideas of the leader. Many cult leaders are charismatic people, and are able to influence people to believe them. P & BM were the ultimate authority. I forget how C phrased it exactly but it was like that even if PM was in error, she would still follow him because it wasnt her place to question. Grr, I wish I could remember exactly how she put it.
5. The fifth aspect is a focus on withholding truth from non-members. Many cults teach their followers to be completely open and truthful within the group, while at the same time they are encouraged to be secretive and evasive when questioned by people outside of the group. The members are taught that outsiders wouldn't understand. Didnt ever really encounter this too much
512 mbs ram
2,something Ghz processor
Windows XP
DVD and cd writer
Its very cool and all for the low low price of $350
This is my rant about vodafone, first they let me go over my prepapy limit by using wap on my new phone. I had always thought that if a person had $20 credit on their phone, then they could use $20 worth of services. But because vodafone wap charges are delayed, a user can actually go over their credit limit very easily and not realise it. I went over my limit by more than $50......Secondly am selling my sony phone on trade me and realised had forgotten the phone lock code so rang vodafone assuming that they would have acess to the default codes for each phone.
"Thats personal information unique to the owner of the phone"
"telecom has the default codes for each phone model on file"
"we're not telecom"
Mensa obviously overlooked this startling undiscovered talent. Luckily I discovered the code was only 4 digits instead of five, but sometimes call centre people are good, othertimes they are absolutley useless. Vodafone seems to employ ok male call takers, but so far in my experience the females are as thick as a 2 by 4
Labels: unlock codes, vodaphone
I took a trip up north. Caught up with Dad which was hmmmm well interesting. Yesterday we took a trip up to Cape Reinga. Its an amazing place of alot of signifigance to Maori, it is believed that when someone of Maori linegae died, their spirit travels up to the cape, and using ropes made of seaweed, lower themsleves down to the Pohutakawa tree on the northern tip. From that point the Spirit makes their way north to their home of Hawaiike. It is know by Maori as Te Rerenga Wairua or the "leaping place of the spirits".
Alas I only had my mobile phone, so the pictuyres werent brilliant. But it was an amazing experience. The last 20kms of statehighway 1 were a dirt road, which was quite amusing as it looks like a proper road on the map. We visted the giant sand dunes as well, they were amazing. It was kind of mind boggling to think of the amount of time it must have taken to form those vast hills of sand
Jeremiah 23 21-22 I did not send these prophets, yet they have run with their message; I did not speak to them, yet they have prophesied.22 But if they had stood in my council, they would have proclaimed my words to my people and would have turned them from their evil ways and from their evil deeds.and Jeremiah 25-32
25 "I have heard what the prophets say who prophesy lies in my name. They say, 'I had a dream! I had a dream!' 26 How long will this continue in the hearts of these lying prophets, who prophesy the delusions of their own minds? 27 They think the dreams they tell one another will make my people forget my name, just as their fathers forgot my name through Baal worship. 28 Let the prophet who has a dream tell his dream, but let the one who has my word speak it faithfully. For what has straw to do with grain?" declares the LORD. 29 "Is not my word like fire," declares the LORD, "and like a hammer that breaks a rock in pieces?
30 "Therefore," declares the LORD, "I am against the prophets who steal from one another words supposedly from me. 31 Yes," declares the LORD, "I am against the prophets who wag their own tongues and yet declare, 'The LORD declares.' 32 Indeed, I am against those who prophesy false dreams," declares the LORD. "They tell them and lead my people astray with their reckless lies, yet I did not send or appoint them. They do not benefit these people in the least," declares the LORD.
The bible is such a totally excellent book
Labels: Bible, false prophets, Jeremiah
Found this Blog on another blog..... It has some good stuff.Labels: Cartoon Church
The trial of Pastor Jones
Judge: Mr. Jones you have been charged with multiple counts of extortion. Your crime spree covers 20 years and thousands of victims. You have defrauded people out of their money with fear and manipulation, telling them they had to tithe 10% of their income to your church and that God would bless them if they did. You also told them that if they didn't tithe God would curse them. How do you plead?
Mr. Jones: I plead not guilty your Honor, I have done nothing wrong. I have only preached what the Bible says. In the Bible Abraham tithed to Melchizedek and God blessed him for his faithful giving. The Bible even says he was rich in silver and gold.
Judge: Is it not true, Mr. Jones, that in Genesis chapter 13 verse 2 the Bible says Abraham was rich with livestock, silver and gold?
Mr. Jones: Yes, you are exactly right, that's what I just told you.
Judge: Ok, we read about Abraham being a rich man in chapter 13 but it is not until Genesis chapter 14 that we read about Abraham's tithe to Melchizedek. So Abraham was already a rich man before he tithed to Melchizedek, wasn't he?
Mr. Jones: Yes, I suppose you are right.
Judge: So his riches were not the result of his tithe to Melchizedek?
Mr. Jones: No.
Judge: Mr. Jones, you also say God blessed him for his faithful giving. How many times is it recorded that Abraham gave tithes to Melchizedek?
Mr. Jones: Well, just once.
Judge: So the Bible never said that he gave week after week?
Mr. Jones: No it does not.
Judge: Where did Abraham get the things that he gave to Melchizedek?
Mr. Jones: Well the Bible says it was from the plunders of war?
Judge: So you are telling me that he gave from the plunders of war?
Mr. Jones: Yes that's what the Bible says.
Judge: So he basically took things that were not really his in the first place and gave them as the tithe?
Mr. Jones: That is what the scripture seems to indicate.
Judge: Is it recorded that he ever took anything from his own possessions
and tithed them to Melchizedek or anyone else?
Mr. Jones: I guess not
Judge: You guess not, you are a Pastor and you are only guessing, is it or
is it not written that he ever gave any of his own possessions as a tithe to
anyone?
Mr. Jones: No it is not written anywhere that I have seen.
Judge: Is it recorded as to what exactly Abraham did give Melchizedek?
Mr. Jones: I believe it says plunder?
Judge: So plunder could be any number of things?
Mr. Jones: Yes, I suppose
Judge: It could have been food, cattle, sheep, the people's
possessions or any number of things. It does not say it was all money
correct?
Mr. Jones: Yes you are correct, it does not say just money
Judge: As a matter of fact money is never mentioned in that account at all
is that correct Mr. Jones?
Mr. Jones: Yes your Honor, money is never mentioned just goods and food and
people.
Judge: So there is no way you can say with any certainty that Abraham in
fact gave Melchizedek any money at all?
Mr. Jones: That is right.
Judge: I only have one last question for you Mr. Jones, did God command Abraham to give this plunder tithe to Melchizedek?
Mr. Jones: No, it appears that he did this voluntarily.
Judge: So are you trying to tell me that because of this voluntary, one time gift by Abraham, that may not have even consisted of money, all Christians everywhere are obligated to bring 10% of their weekly paycheck to a local church?
Judge: Considering all the evidence I would say you are beyond any shadow of a doubt guilty of deliberately trying to make the scriptures says things they have not said for financial gain.
Mr. Jones: Ok your Honor, I can see how foolish I was to try and use the story of Melchizedeck to try and get the people to tithe money. But there are many other verses that will support my belief on tithing. Jacob said he would give God 10% of everything. I think we should follow his example.
Judge: Let's see what Jacob said. Please read the verse you are talking about for me Mr. Jones.
Mr. Jones: In Genesis chapter 28 starting at verse 20 it says. Jacob vowed a vow, saying, "If God will be with me, and will keep me in this way that I go, and will give me bread to eat, and clothing to put on, so that I come again to my father's house in peace, and Yahweh will be my God, then this stone, which I have set up for a pillar, will be God's house. Of all that you will give me I will surely give the tenth to you."
Judge: You said we should follow Jacobs's example, is that right Mr. Jones?
Mr. Jones: Yes that is right, he vowed to give a tenth and we should too.
Judge: Let me point out one thing for you Mr. Jones, Jacob said he would Give God a tenth, ONLY if He blessed him first. So as you said previously, we should follow Jacob's example and tell God that we will only give him a tenth if he blesses us first. Is that right?
Mr. Jones: That is not what I meant.
Judge: What did you mean then?
Mr. Jones: That we should give God a tenth also.
Judge: There you go again, trying to make the scripture say what you want it to say for your benefit. I would also like you to tell me the scriptures that say that Jacob kept his vow with God. I would also like to know where he gave the tenth to because there was no temple or levites to give it to at that time.
Mr. Jones: I can not think of any scriptures that say where or if he ever tithed after his vow.
Judge: It seems fairly obvious to me that Jacob made a voluntary and conditional vow to God. This in no way can be used as a reason to demand others to bring their income to you or any other place.
Mr. Jones: I do have a few more scriptures that I believe will show that we are supposed to tithe.
Judge: You have not said anything yet to convince me one little bit that people are obligated to tithe money to the local churches and that you were justified in what you were doing. You have taken scripture and misapplied it to your beliefs and for your gain. But in order to be fair to you I will allow you to present more evidence.
Mr. Jones: In the book of Malachi chapter 3 starting at verse 8 it says, will a man rob God? yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, In what have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings. Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation. Bring ye all the tithes into the store-house, that there may be food in my house, and prove me now with this, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. So you see your Honor, we are commanded to bring the tithes into the storehouse or God will curse us.
Judge: Answer me this Mr. Jones, were you aware that God never required anyone to tithe money?
Mr. Jones: No I didn't know that.
Judge: The tithe spoken of here was always edible products never money.
Mr. Jones: well your Honor that is because they didn't have money at the time so God had them tithe food instead.
Judge: Not true, money is first mentioned in Genesis and Malachi was written hundreds of years later. God had them bring food in so that the levites, the fatherless and widows may eat and be satisfied. The tithe was used mainly to take care of people. Also notice it says in the verse you quoted, that there may be food in my house. How do you completely overlook the word food in those verses?
Mr. Jones: I don't know
Judge: I also want you to know that these verses speak to people under the Old Testament law. As you may or may not know Jesus fulfilled the law, it is no longer binding. Tithing was part of that law that has been abolished.
Judge: Once again you have tried to completely take a scripture out of context and apply it to others for your benefit. Can you give me a single scripture where God changed the tithe from food to money?
Mr. Jones: I do not know of any.
Judge: So if God never changed it from food to money who did?
Mr. Jones: Man must have.
Judge: So far all you have done Mr. Jones is take Old Testament scriptures out of context and try to apply it to believers under the New Covenant. Is this all the proof you have?
Mr. Jones: I do have a New Testament scripture that will show that Jesus told us to tithe.
Judge: Ok let me hear it.
Mr. Jones: Jesus said in Matthew 23:23 "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you tithe mint, dill, and cumin, and have left undone the weightier matters of the law: justice, mercy, and faith. But you ought to have done these, and not to have left the other undone. See Jesus said we should be tithing.
Judge: Let me ask you a question, who was Jesus talking to?
Mr. Jones: The scripture says the scribes and Pharisees.
Judge: Are you a scribe or Pharisee?
Mr. Jones: Of course not.
Judge: Jesus also said in that passage, you have left undone the weightier matters of the law. Are we under the law Mr. Jones?
Mr. Jones: No.
Judge: Why not?
Mr. Jones: Because Jesus fulfilled it.
Judge: When did Jesus fulfill the law?
Mr. Jones: When He was crucified.
Judge: So the law was still in effect until Jesus death?
Mr. Jones: That is correct.
Judge: I think you know where I am going with this don't you?
Mr. Jones: Yes your Honor. Since Jesus had not yet been crucified and the law was still binding the Pharisees were required to tithe because it was part of the law. Once the law ended, tithing ended also.
Judge: I want you to take a look at that verse again. Also tell me, what were they tithing?
Mr. Jones: The scripture says it was mint, dill and cumin.
Judge: Is money mentioned?
Mr. Jones: No it was not.
Judge: Once again it was edible products that they were tithing, not money. Do you have anything else you would like to say?
Mr. Jones: If people only tithed edible products like the scripture says, then how would the church survive? We have our mortgage payment, utility bills, my salary and a host of other things that we have to pay each week. We depend on the money from the people.
Judge: The need does not justify the means. In other words, just because you have all these debts does not give you the right to twist and manipulate scripture and cause people to give under fear of being cursed by God to meet your needs. In closing, let me recap a few things for you Mr. Jones. The tithe was never money; the tithe was an Old Testament law, which is no longer binding. When it was binding the tithe was used to take care of people, not buildings. We are under a new covenant now. Paul instructs the Corinthian believers how they are to give. He says in second Corinthians chapter 9 verse 7, Let each man give according as he has determined in his heart; not grudgingly, or under compulsion; for God loves a cheerful giver. So each believer is supposed to give as he or she has determined in his or her heart. If you are trying to make people give under the threat of being cursed or any other reason you are wrong. Someone can not give cheerfully if they are being forced to give. If your church can not survive on freewill offerings maybe God is not part of your church at all.
Mr. Jones: I never realized all these things, I have always been taught that we had to tithe money to the local church and that is what I have always taught. I can see now that I was completely wrong. I did not study the scripture for myself, I only took mans word for it. Yes I am guilty. I will not teach this error anymore.
Judge: Mr. Jones, I can see that you done this in ignorance and are repentant, this court will not hold you accountable. It is your responsibility to know the truth. I would advise you and everyone else in this courtroom to really start studying the Bible and seeking God on the subject of tithing and your eyes will be open. Do not just take mans word any longer. Start seeking God as to how and where He would have you give. Court adjourned.
Anyhow, was getting sick of the fact that one particular mod seems to take joy in closing down threads that he doesnt agree with, labeling them as closed for staff review. "Closed for staff review" should mean that a mod will review the thread, deal with rule violations and then reopen the thread. The fact that these "closed for review threads' were never reopened, further added weight to my "this mod shuts threads where he doesnt agree with the OP" theory. Anyhow, after getting a warning for complaining about the number of threads that were "closed for review" and never reopened I decided to take a different tack and began reporting this mod's closing posts. The most recent one, a discussion about generational curses began by GodisMyRefuge aka Jeff Harshbarger of refuge ministries, he is a stand up bloke, who is not afraid to stand up against the dodgy theology that has perpetrated the christian church. I reported this mod's closing post, and suprise surprise the thread was reopened several hours later and no changes had been made to the thread. Again supporting my "this mod shuts down threads that he doesnt agree with" theory.
Do I feel victorious that I caused a biased mod to have to reopen a thread that he shut down that he didnt agree with? HECK no! I'd much rather this mod could be fair, unbiased and do his job without needing to try and censor those he doesnt agree with.
Maybe in a perfect world perhaps.
I got in a discussion last night with T, who is a friend of Y who is my flatmate. First of all he started talking about borderline personaility disorder and the fact that the government doesnt fund borderline personality disorder. Well he was wrong on that point, the government will fund treatment for a person who is borderline, however the person who is being treated has to want to be treated and has to want to change their situation. Didnt think I should mention that I am a recovered borderline.Then he started bitching and moaning about the system is rubbish and kind of going on about conspiracy theories. Arm chair critics piss me off immensly. I mean letter writing, and what not is all very well and good, however how often does it actually make a difference. I was a big meanie and put him on the spot, and asked him what he was doing to make a practical difference for the people who he thought the system was failing. As with all armchair critics, he blustered and babled about vague things he had suposedlly accomplished with his letter writing. But when I asked for specifics, he couldnt give me any
Arm chair critics, just piss me off
Labels: Armchair critics
Her emotional baggage is so much that she feels that she will bleed from the pain
Pain relief comes at the knife drawn across her skin,
The pain leaves her with the release of blood